The Council Officers (and Solicitor) where absolutely correct in stopping Cllrs citing Traffic & Vitality in their rejection.
I'm sure the letter writers are both acknowledged experts as retail analysts and traffic management consultants, but the truth is, the "expert" opinion which the Council has to consider (rather than any amount of armchair experts) say that the development will not cause an undue increase in traffic congestion and will not harm the overall vitality of the town.
The continued claim that the majority of the town's population is against the development, also does stack up. Yes the majority of the people who wrote to the planning officer are against the scheme, but this is what the process allows. It isn't an X-Factor voting system. It allows people with genuine objections to raise them with the planning officer.
I also do not believe that the majority of the people at the meeting were opposed to Tesco. The attendees fell into three camps.
1. Opposed in principle to Tesco or and major supermarket.
2. Opposed to the scheme as presented.
3. In favour of the scheme as presented.
I would accept that camp 3 had the fewest followers.
If you are going to comment on this blog, please note I'm not going to publish crass comments, abuse or articles where I have reason to believe the copyright is not owned by the person posting.
I welcome reasoned argument and factual corrections.
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45 comments:
Does anyone know when and what times during the day the traffic surveys were carried out?
Yes, all the details of positions, times and dates are in the planning documents.
How do you know that camp 3 had the fewest followers? I'm not so sure.
The Tenbury Futures survey has shown little support for a large supermarket on that site.
Camp 3 does have the fewest. Just look at the OBJECTIONS. Also take look at the Tenbury futures survey. The truth is there in front of you
Supermarket is not needed or wanted
As I have said many many times before, you can't judge by the number of objections vs the number of letters of support. The planning system is all about objections, it's not an election or a TV vote phone in.
Tenbury futures only had 100 replies from people living in Tenbury Town and I would bet that in the majority of cases they were the same people who wrote letters of objection.
Just face it tesco asda morrisons etc is not wanted or needed people have objected people have said the people in favour are a minority why can't you see that?
What your saying WR15 is that because only a fraction of the population objected to tesco then that must mean they are for it. That is a very unrealistic way at looking at things. There are people that have an opinion but doesn't show it. Them not writing in objecting to tesco doesn't mean they are for.
I think if you read back over the months I have consistently said that I believe the majority are either for or have no opinion either way.
I do not believe the majority are against a supermarket.
I do not believe that the majority are for the existing scheme.
I do believe that the numbers for will increase if a suitable scheme is submitted.
I do not believe that the planning objections are an accurate measure of support.
WR15 -What concrete evidence have you got to support you claims that the majority do want a supermarket? ,or is it just 'hearsay'
Please read what I wrote.
I'm not claiming what you say I'm claiming.
mr anonymous people do want a supermarket on the auction yard you dont need to shop there yourself,
cant you see that tenbury is a dying town.
tenbury is nothing to what is was years ago.
no doubt you shop out of town yourself .
Tesco would bring more life back in the town
MR ANONYMOUS if you dont like it pack your bags and move
WR15 you said you won't Publish anything crass? If a no tesco person posted to tell a yes tesco person to pack tour bags and move I doubt you would publish
This just shows this blo is biased
Mr anonymous the figures shows te majority don't want or need a supermarket no I won't pack my bags and move I'm Tenbury born and bred why should I move because of selfish people who want to ruin this lovely town.
Perhaps the truth is that we will never have decisive measure of opposition/support unless there is some kind of referendum - and I can’t see anyone willing to organise/finance one. My instincts (having spoken to many people in the Town) tell me that the majority are either indifferent or in favour but, as has been pointed out many times, that does not prove anything. As WR15 rightly says, the number of objection letters and the Tenbury Futures survey do not prove anything either. The whole argument is rather futile. So far as the Advertiser letters are concerned – their ignorance is only matched by some of the Councillors on the Planning Committee who voted again the Tesco application. They were clearly (because they said so) voting on grounds that either had nothing to do with the planning application or because of concerns that had already been resolved by independent professional consultants. All-in-all, it’s a pretty unedifying spectacle.
Where are all these people in support ? They have had the opportuninity to write in to MHDC fill in a Tenbury Futures Questionnaire - Both of the above tell same story (fact not fiction).
Ludlow is a lovely place to live if you want a Tesco .
Mr Anonymous how many years ago are you going back?
This is my blog so I can be as biased as I want.
I agree with Ian, that what some of the Cllrs said was a disgrace. If Tesco's have grounds for appeal it would be that some Cllrs clearly didn't vote on planning grounds but based their own personal prejudices.
No wonder the Council solicitor looked aghast and a smile passed across the faces of the Tesco representatives!
what i was saying wr15 that if i were to say
"mr anonymous why don't you pack up and move away" you wouldn't post it
you said on previous posts you made this blog to make a FAIR chance to express opinions about the events of tenbury. but like your accusing the cnlrs your taking your own PERSONAL opinions and posting what you feel fit as in tesno people you hardly do and yesco/people for tesco you always no matter what they say
"you said on previous posts you made this blog to make a FAIR chance to express opinions about the events of tenbury. but like your accusing the cnlrs your taking your own PERSONAL opinions and posting what you feel fit as in tesno people you hardly do and yesco/people for tesco you always no matter what they say" . . . is this blogger sober?!
I was rather hoping someone would translate it for me, after all I wasn't born here so don't fully understand the dialect.
no i have drunken 12 bottles of jd 10 bottles of three barrles and a can of strongbow
and yes all bought from local shops in tenbury
just about proves my point!!!
Interesting stuff..
Tesco recently claimed that 'most people want a Tesco' in Sandiacre, East Midlands. Sandiacre already has various supermarkets inc an Aldi and Lidl etc. The highstreet has ceased to be there though, trade has polarised to the supermarkets and still Tesco want a piece of the fading action it would seem by building their own new superstore adjacent to another local supermarket.
They recently ran a supposedly impartial 'survey' there which was in actuality passed-out mainly to existing Tesco Clubcard Holders in the town [pop approx 8000]. They eventually handed out about 4200 and received a small fraction back - 512 replies eventually. From their own subsequent 'analysis of comments' behind closed doors [which wasn't verified in any way by 3rd parties] they ascertained that "the majority want a Tesco too [here] in Sandiacre".
Whatever you think about the 'Futures' survey, it's always been very visible and overtly trades on handing over copies of ALL the 289 forms and comments handed in to local organisations such as TTC and MHDC for ref in future devt discussions in relation to the cattle market site.
proves your point?
what proves your point
if i really drank all of that don't you think i'd be in a&e and not on the computer?
so what is your POINT?
I see Tesco did one of their traffic surveys on a Saturday .I would think this is Tenburys quietest days for traffic bar Sundays It would be a lot more realistic to do it on a Monday from 8.30am -12.30pm then view the chaos on the bridge .
"so what is your POINT?" . . . that inebriated or sober, you need to get something done about your incoherent aggressiveness.
I agree that the Traffic survey is flawed. In most Towns Saturday afternoon is the busiest time of the week but not so in Tenbury.
The other document that is flawed is the analysis of the available Public Transport. It would be impossible for all but a few of their staff to travel to work by Public Transport, so this means the proposed number of parking spaces is woefully inadequate.
A lot of buses are being axed this year to save money so the bus plan they did is now useless.
Having recently moved to Tenbury from a town with 5 times the population of T W, I can assure you that the town is not dead. The town I come from has now virtually all of the major supermarkets in town but the high street is totally dead except for the stores offering something the supermarkets do not offer, i.e. opticians, charity shops or local merchandise.
The arrival of a major supermarket would destroy the town and we would all lose out.
Our local shops are not perfect - but then nothing is...
With the availability of online shopping and relatively short distances to major supermarkets in other towns we do not need the drop in quality of produce, loss of local 'profits' or what are often higher prices that would result from the arrival of a major supermarket chain.
Supermarkets bring convenience and usually succeed through our apathy in not visiting the local baker, butcher, hardware store etc after we pick-up our convenience shopping even though we know that the price and quality is superior in the independents.
I have nothing against Tesco and admire their success but the supermarkets as a concept have probably harmed our society and the ability of most people to earn a decent wage more than anything else that has occurred in the UK over the last 20 years.
frequent mover
you are not welcome it new comers like u with your comuting that kill towns
I wonder where Tenbury would be without incomers?
No Takeaways, No Restaurants, No Pubs, Hardly any Shops, Few Clubs & Societies, No Doctors, No Dentists.
Anonymous how can you say that new comers are not welcome in tenbury how many of the popalation of tenbury and burford can say that they were born here a lot of tenbury is built of outsiders now i would of thought and its those people that have helped tenbury traders to keep going for as long as they have
Dear Anon
I am not a commuter, I live and work here and in time hope to provide decent jobs with reasonable pay in the town.
I understand your concern about commuters, however, generalisation is always risky. It is whether they are spending money here and supporting / involved in the community that is the relevant point not where they work.
PS: Apart from 'anon' I have been made hugely welcome around the town as we use the local shops and services. I am very pleased we have moved here.
Very valid points WR15 and frequent mover.. Where indeed would this town be without new people, new ideas and new possibilities* etc..?
* [within reason of course] ;-)
I wonder how many Tenbury shopkeepers were born and bred in Tenbury?
I bet it's not many!
Exactly outsiders come in to the town open up a buisness which brings people into the town and your telling new comers and outsiders that they are not welcome in our town are you tenbury born and bread cause i am
It really would be helpful for those trying to follow the thread of the blog to have the "Anonymous" contributors identified by a number, say "Anonymous 1" and "Anonymous 2". Is that possible?
Only if they select Name and then type in either Anonymous plus a number or call them self something more identifiable. I could force everyone to register to comment, but feel that would put a lot of people off.
anon your saying new comers ruin tenbury?
Well TESCO WILL BE A NEW STORE so what your saying anon is TESCO WILL KILL TENBURY
thanks for finally admitting that
So who owns the land now then? Has Chase sold up?
Ducks under the parapet.
Another dirty incomer here, and a filthy commuter to boot.
Don't suppose it matters that my money earned many miles away pays taxes here and is by and large spent locally if not directly in town.
Good idea, rather than be 'anon' people can use a name - choose what you want, then stick to it.
All you have to do is when you leave a comment, choose Name/URL then enter the name you picked!
I find the comments of some people on here about newcomers/commuters (I repeat *some* and thankfully they are the minority) frankly quite offensive. I came here with my husband and a young baby quite a long time ago and we initially were referred to by some as 'yuppies' from London. Once here, we had 2 more children, who now both work in the town. I am still a commuter to Birmingham and my husband actually works overseas currently, but much of our income is still spent locally, as is that of our two younger children at the moment. Would you who protest prefer us not to be here? In my experience, those who protest most about change contribute the least in real terms to benefiting their community.
Hear! Hear! Lesley.
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